Oh man. Decades of hiring pakies, chinks, chugs, and racial/sexual trash has turned the RCMP into the keystone cops. This cop sounds like Joe Catface when he’s half in the bag… and shoots like him too…
FFS. How far away is the car? 25 yards? These goofs had trouble keeping the shots on the car. Who taught these guys how to shoot? And who signed them off? And the perp escaped afterward…
Sigh.
Y’know I hear the yanks bitching all the time about the FBI and I get it… but hell’s bells, I’m old enough to remember when the Mounties were right up there with law enforcement agencies like Scotland Yard.
😞
Yeah. Y’know… I think I’ll be keeping my guns thanks, Mr. Prime Minister…
and trying to out yell the siren.
ReplyDeleteOne of the take-aways of the 1986 FBI shoot-out in Miami was law enforcements mindset/reluctance to not use their long-arms even when it is readily available.
ReplyDeleteI get that they always have their handgun so it is a no-thinking, its there tool. But the gomer was immobilized and wasn't going anywhere very fast.
Two cops with ARs or 30-30 Win or SMLEs spread out 60 degrees from the target and it would have been game-over.
Well shoot. Joe - I am pretty sure some of those squad cars are carrying 870 shotties and surely those goofs could handle that competently, I'd think?
DeleteI dunno if they are backing around AR's or not... but a well placed load of 00 buck woulda cut that episode much shorter...
LOL...seriously? I'm not gonna armchair quarterback this because a.) I've been in this guy's shoes a time or two, and b.) because of that, I know what he had to work with.
ReplyDeleteBut how about you? When was the last time YOU were in a gunfight, Glen? How about any of your readers? Have any of you even so much as heard a shot fired in anger? Have you even been in a fistfight in your entire adult lives? I'm gonna guess probably not. And no, those times you gave your old lady a fat lip doesn't count.
And I'd guess 'probably not' because if you had, you'd know damn well that shooting at 25 yards on a square range is worlds apart from shooting in a fluid 3D environment, while you're jacked on adrenaline and your target is some asshole equally jacked on adrenaline (and probably crystal meth) who is shooting back at you.
I don't know this police officer. But whatever you might think of his shooting ability, by virtue of the mere nature of the incident and how it played out, he's lucky to be alive. So is the suspect, who by the way did get shot a few times and somehow managed to live.
I mean, really Glen...tell me you're not THAT obtuse that you'd really believe that actual gunfights play out the way they do in Hollywood movies.
You should know me better than that JL. I am as obtuse, rotund, and gaseous as they come! And proud of it!!! HAR HAR HAR!!!
DeleteAnd yes I have shit myself again, it appears. This is just a crappy vid, the guys coulda been at the end of a tough shift, yadda yadda yadda.
And even with the DEI crap I spouted... my disgust is less with the officers and far, far more with their training. I've seen you guys at my gun club, the local constabulary here use my range to train and I am just peachy with it. But it is far, far too little. I've seen the average officer shoot. There's no nice way to say it: your training is shit, and the results showed here on the vid. Don't get mad at me - I'm saying this because I love our cops and squaddies and I want to see them live and go home to their families.
If I was your boss with the wherewithal to turn out competent shooters, You'd be required to spend two to three nights a week on the range. You would have to go through at least 5000~10,000 rounds a year. I'd insist you guys get at least a couple trips a year to the so-called "kill houses" that the SEALs and squaddies use to train. I would further require every last one of you guys to carry firearms even when off duty and be prepared to use them at the drop of a hat. Properly trained, in this incident? The driver's side windshield should have been a mess of powdered and broken glass. The perp should have died in that car and never gotten out.
DeleteMy official stance on the incident isn't that this isn't incompetence so much as a lack of proper training. Properly trained, even the women, pajeets, and DEI flunkies should have been able to neutralize that perp in seconds.
I got in supreme shit a couple years back when that failed liberal social experiment decided to go to the food court at the mall and shoot it up - but there happened to be another kid there with a piece of shit compact Glock. When the perp pulled his gun to start shooting - the kid pulled his cheapo pistol and did a mag dump on the perp from 40 long paces away. Something like two or three shots missed - the rest went straight into the boiler room and put that turd down for good.
DeleteThe gunnies all clapped and barked with glee and adoration - the kid was Wyatt Earp reborn!!! What a hero!!!
I said nonsense - the kid WAS a good shot, he WAS a hero... but he hadn't done anything you or I couldn't do. He'd put his time in at the range, and when he made the decision to end the perp - his hands went into drill mode, and even with the pucker factor - just about every shot hit. His success was all about training, and nothing else.
I hope YOU are staying on top of your pistolcraft, JL. And your friends too. You owe it to yourselves and your families. And, of course - to your fan boys.
:)
To JL's comment, I hace survived an attack by a junky who tried to car jack me in Edmonton. I'm not going to comment on the video because i wasn't there, but my experience was hand to hand against a guy with a screw driver and maglight trying to stab and club me like a baby seal.
DeleteI got so focused on fighting the asshole who attached me I never saw his cohort sneak up behind me and kick out my knee.
My point is sometimes you get so focused you get tunnel vision.
Exile1981
@ Glen: I wanted to wait until I was off shift and had to type a better answer. Easier to do that on my PC than on my stupid phone. Anyway.
DeleteThe problem we have is not the quality of training in modern policework. In actuality, the kind of training we get is actually a lot better than people give it credit for. Could it be better? Yeah, probably. But so could anything else. No, the issue is the 'quantity' of training police officers, as a whole get. I can't speak to the profession of policing in general, or even the Force as a whole, because each Detachment/Department differs from place to place. It really depends on your 'op-tempo', so to speak.
What it boils down to is this: the amount of time available to commit to training and, to a significant extent the money and logistics available to commit to training.
The thing is, most police officers simply do not have the amount of time to commit to training to the level of a world class gunfighter. Unless they make it a hobby that encompasses the vast majority of their spare time (and sometimes you see guys actually do this in shooting sports such as IPSC or IDPA, although it's not the norm - and it's dying thanks to the assholes in Ottawa), it's simply not realistic.
Most of our jobs encompass being social workers/babysitters for our society's lowest common denominators. From basically having to deal with shitty kids and their equally shitty parents and all the problems that go along with them; to dealing with every swinging dick nutjob, drug addict, and mental health case of which there is no shortage; to dealing with our whiny, entitled, spoiled bastard citizens who, no matter how much you try to please them, still bitch and moan to no fucking end because you can't solve THEIR problems because THEY are the center of the ENTIRE UNIVERSE, and HOW DARE YOU not make MY problems go away....well, you can kinda see how the stuff that's important can easily take a backseat. This is to say nothing of the constant staff shortages, budget cuts, and other semi-political horseshit cops get shanghaied with on a regular basis.
Look, you're preaching to the preacher here: skills maintenance is paramount. Whether it's shooting, driving, arrest control tactics/combatives...yes, I totally agree it's important. I learned long ago that, "in a crisis, people don't rise to their expectactions - they fall to their level of training". This is totally true. I mean, this is a game we, as cops cannot afford to lose. IMHO, we are not allowed to lose because we are not paid to lose....but sometimes, it happens.
And that's just it. Because, on the other hand, at the end of the day, all training 'can' really do is give you an edge. That's it. There are some situations where you can be as best trained or best prepared as you can....and it won't matter. Shit happens. And no matter how much you prepare or train, things will NEVER go the way you envision them. That doesn't mean don't train, but it does mean that there are limitations on training and preparedness and it's delusional to ignore them.
There'll always be an X factor, especially in combat. Because you don't know what the other guy will do or what he knows. Or, worse, as in Exile's anecdote, things could take a spin for the worse and you could wind up dealing with weapons or multiple attackers or the engagement could wind up on the ground. Sometimes, you just get served up a shit sandwich and you just gotta deal with it. In his case especially, where he talks about 'tunnel vision', yes...combat physiology is a thing. SNS Override is a thing. They have very real effects on how you react to high stress incidents such as combat.
DeleteI'm not a huge fan of his work, but Lt. Col. Grossman wrote some pretty interesting stuff on the subject of combat physiology (mostly taken from other people who wrote about the subject, but still). So did guys like Bruce Siddle and Loren W. Christensen, whose writing happens to be a personal favorite of mine. I highly recommend checking out work by those authors.
Yes. I know you're not hating on cops like, say, Divemedic or Aesop and the people who frequent their blogs. And to be fair, I was kinda busting your balls, consummate asshole that I am. But still....you know me well enough by now to count on me to call an ace an ace and a spade a spade.
No hard feelings. Now stop shitting yourself and hit the showers.
Agreed… I suppose I can take my annual shower a month early.
DeleteI am an acolyte of Jeff Cooper and Bill Jordan and a couple other classic gunnies. Most of my thought process comes from Cooper. He stresses mindset as a key component to successful gun fighting. He’s not the only one, I’ve seen others on the mil blogs and vlogs say it too. Neither of those officers were thinking when they engaged the perp. I read almost everything Cooper ever wrote, from hunting, to pistol craft, to politics. Jordan knew how to spin a yarn and impart practical knowledge. Both are worth your time if you have it to spare.
But sadly you’re absolutely right about it; cops are expected to be everything BUT cops nowadays… and yeah…maybe Aesop and DM *may* have a little ammo for their bias… but there isn’t a damn thing that can be done until the judiciary is cleaned the f out… and the politicos too. They are far, far higher on the shit list than rank and file police, and no bones about it…
YES! Mindset. 100%
DeleteI own a few of Col. Cooper's works and they sit proudly in my somewhat extensive library. This something he, and many whom he has trained (some of whom I was fortunate enough to train with when I had more youth, spare time, and disposable income) also stress extensively. It's a matter of 'software' vs. 'hardware'.
In fact, if there's is one thing I'd say police officers are lacking, right across the board, it is a lack of the proper 'warrior' mindset. We used to teach this, once upon a time...unfortunately, it is not politically correct. But, in your above example you spoke of, regarding that kid in the mall (I believe it was in Indiana, IIRC), I believe it was MOSTLY the proper cultivation of a warrior/combat mindset in that lad that caused him to rise to the occasion amd take out that psycho with the AR.
Unfortunately, this cuts both ways. Because training cops with that mindset also comes with the eventual bitching and whining about 'militarization' of police - and not just from the shitlibs, but also the Aesop/DM/wannabe prepper tacticool crowd, where they complain about how cops are treating the public like the enemy, clearly (and perhaps ironically) buying into the communist liberal media ACAB narratives.
So really...how do you win? Well, to be honest I don't give a fuck. You can't please everyone. All I know is I'm going home alive at the end of my shift. Come Hell or high water.
I'm just going say the radio chatter was fucking hilarious! You canucks! Love the accent. "Shots fired, I think". "Are you hurt? Did he shoot you?" "He shot my car, my windshield has a bullet hole in it" "where are you?" "Just give me a minute". I'm fucking dying here.
ReplyDeleteIf the caliber of the user is high enough. The caliber of the tool is not important. the inverse is also true. If you're going to own a tool you better be able to use it effectively. If not then you end up on police payroll...
ReplyDelete